No Steaming.....

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

I took delivery of my first real espresso macine on Wednesday..... the Mini Vivaldi and a Mazzer Mini Grinder. I was looking at the new Duetto as well, but decided on the Vivaldi after talking with Mary at Chris Coffee. I did call back twice and sent an e-mail prior to shipment asking that they take all the time they needed to bench test the machine and make sure I would have no problems. I should note that the machine was previously returned by another buyer who wanted a machine that could be plumbed in.

The espresso portion of the machine seems to be working flawlessly and my shots seem to be only limited by my own inexperience.

The milk steamer and hot water dispenser never worked correctly straight out of the box. I'll get about two seconds of steam and then a complete shut down of that boiler followed by the three lights (one yellow, two red) at the end of the line being lit up steady. This was very frustrating. My wife who was still in disbelief on how much I spent on a "coffee maker" is now taking every single opportunity to explain to myself, our friends, and our family what a complete dolt I am.

I can tolerate her ....I've been putting up with it for years.....

What I want is a decent cup of coffee!

The folks down at Chris Coffee have been handling it about as well as I could hope. My initial e-mail got a quick response and a part arrived next day from UPS. I had to remove the top, back, and sides to get the part in. Having the machine completely disassembled on our kitchen counter generated a bit of flack from wifey.....but I got through it.

The new part (some sort of sensor) didn't help a bit. So I left a message on the Chris Coffee help line at 7:00 pm on a Friday night......a fella (Tim) called me back 20 minutes later......WOW!

Nice guy....he couldn't help the problem much.....but he tried. I gotta send the whole machine back on Monday. Exactly what I didn't want to happen. Tim told me they would have it back to me in less than a week and they would pay the shipping charges. He also said they would send something along to conpensate for the frustration level. I inquired about the availability of arsenic laced espresso beans for my bride....but I don't think he understood the problem.

I'm gonna enjoy the espresso only part of the show until Monday morning when I dutifully pack the baby up and send her back to Albany to get her fixed up right.

If anyone has any helpful ideas...I'ld love to hear them.

Jack Rabbit Slim
Stafford, CT

[JohnB]

The 3(19,20,21) lights on steady is the damaged boiler temp probe alarm. Have you checked all connections on top of the steam boiler? I'm over in Danielson which isn't very far from you. I bet if you drove over to my shop today or tomorrow with the Mini we could figure out the problem. I've had my S1V2 all apart so I'm pretty familiar with the internals. PM if you want to bring it over & I'll send contact info.

Alternatively Albany is a quick 2 hour drive up the Mass Pike if you don't want to wait a week & go through the hassle of shipping.

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

Are you kidding Me..???....Thanks a bunch for the offer! I am tempted to do just that....but between Soccer Games today and tomorrow and other obligations I wouldn't be able to sneak off to Danielson.

I did wiggle and pinch every connection I could get my fingers on while I had covers off. The temp sensor probe was the new part they sent me.

My wife works for Fed Ex....so I know first hand of the horror stories of package handling. Her first week there she came home and solemly told me to NEVER EVER buy a Dell computer and have it delivered via Fed Ex.

[JohnB]

I'll be around tomorrow if you change your mind. Does the steam boiler pressure drop right off when the steam/hot water cuts off? How high does the pressure build up when the boiler heater kicks in.

Your wife & friends will be more understanding once you start making them coffee drinks.

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

" Does the steam boiler pressure drop right off when the steam/hot water cuts off?"

Yes...


"How high does the pressure build up when the boiler heater kicks in?"

2,0.....there is occaisionally a thumping noise which temporarily will slightly reduce the pressure. Almost like a relief valve popping.


"Your wife & friends will be more understanding once you start making them coffee drinks."

[chas]

Yikes! 2bar would put your steam pressure right in the middle of the red zone. You could be right that the noise is the relief valve opening up to prevent your steam boiler from become part of your walls!

As John noted, the three alarm lights you see are shown in the manual to mean that the temp probe has failed - open if temp reading stays below 60C or shorted if the temp reading stays over 125C. That is the part CC sent you. However, you have stated that the lights don't come on until you open the steam valve or the hot water and then the boiler turns off and you get very little steam. To me that sounds like the temp probe is OK and something else is causing the problem.

1) The heater element is not turning off when it should.
2) The boiler is not refilling with the proper amount water.

The first one would require that the steam boiler triac comes on and stays on, There is actually another alarm to sense that and I think it would result in the entire unit shutting off. (The same three lights would be blinking instead of steady.) You would be able to tell this as well since the boiler light would blink continuously and not turn off. In this case an alarm would occur sooner than later even with the machine sitting idle.

The fact that is only happens when you open a valve and then you get very little steam would indicate to me that the water level sensor may actually be at fault. The photo below is the top of my VII steam boiler. I think the top of the mini looks the same. LaSpaz keeps changing wire gauges and colors so ignore any differences there. The part you have already changed is the one with the thick gray wire right in the middle of the boiler top. The water level sensor is the one right next to it with the pink wire in this picture. You should pull this connector off and push it back on to ensure a good connection if you haven't already. I don't think there could be an issue at the other end where this wire connects to the controller board because the wire from the group temp sensor is on the same connector. If that connector wiggled loose in transit you'd have problems with the group temperature as well.

Top of Steam Boiler

VIIBoilerTop.jpg (95.11 KiB) Viewed 26269 times

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

That pink wire is green on mine. CC had me pull it off and reboot the machine. I think he was looking for something specific to happen when I rebooted with that wire disconnected. Whatever it was......it didn't happen.....he suspected there might be a short somewhere on along that wire. He was also concerned that there might be damage to the heating element in the boiler....

I hear what you are saying about the pressure release valve....I lost control of a pressure cooker once......what a friggin mess!

[zoey]

Here's a photo of the boiler on the Mini if it helps:

403_IMG_0278_1.jpg (68.41 KiB) Viewed 26252 times

[JohnB]

If the Mini boiler has a drain plug in the bottom same as the S1 does you could let the machine cool down & drain/measure the amount of water thats in there after it refills. The pump does kick in after the water/steam cuts off on you?? It certainly sounds like it is not filling completely.

[chas]

Any luck or did you just decide to punt and ship it back? In either case, please report back with what the problem and final resolution is.

I don't believe this exact problem and symptoms have been reported before so it will be a good one to add to the archives.

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

I punted.......it arrived in the capable hands of CC today. Shipping it back turned out to be surprisingly easy. I still had the double boxes and packing material that it originally came in. Sunday night I went to the UPS website and requested that a driver pick it up at our home.......and we live waaaaaay out in the middle of nowhere at the end of a very lonely dirt road. UPS picked it up Monday morning....CC received delivery Tuesday at 11:00 am. Delivery got charged to my credit card for $50....CC promised to reimburse it.

I'll certainly keep you posted on what happens......I appreciate all the help so far. Hopefully we'll be up and steaming by the weekend.

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

Unbelievably......after receiving my machine and plugging it in....the folks up at CC reported that my machine was working flawlessly????????? I don't know what to think....they couldn't come up with much of an explanation either. Mary and Tim quickly advocated that they would send me a brand new machine with some free coffee for my troubles. I couldn't ask for any better service.....

I can't fathom what the problem was. Tim worked with me over the phone while I stood in front of the machine for nearly 30 minutes last friday. But he said once he received it....he couldn't replicate the error codes I was continuosly getting.

Could it be the outlet? I switched the outlet to a 20 amp and I checked at the fuse box. That line already had a 20 amp breaker and the wire was definitely an extremly heavy gage....I could hardly bend it. I never had a problem with it tripping. There was always plenty of water in the reservoir. Mary thought it possible that maybe something clogged the water line.....?

I'm thinking the banging around in shipping relocated something loose...........I'm soooooooo happy they are sending me another one....

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

Well.....the new machine arrived......seems to be working perfectly. I do hear a very soft humming occasionally that I NEVER heard on the old one. I think it is the steaming boiler filling up......I'm also thinking that's what wasn't working on the first machine.

[JohnB]

Never heard a vibe pump running described as a soft humming! Is this sound in addition to the pump running when the boiler refills?

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

I think that IS the sound of the pump running......a soft whirring noise.....

[JohnB]

I think that IS the sound of the pump running......a soft whirring noise.....

Is this also as loud as the pump gets when you are pulling a shot? If so you have the worlds quietest vibe pump.

[MDL]

I think that you are probably hearing the fan which turns on when the steam boiler is heating.

I don't think that the pump "cycles"...

[Jack Rabbit Slim]

ahhhhhhhh.....the "fan" theory sounds accurate!

[zoey]

If it's generally heard when you first turn the boiler on, it's due to filling. It lasts for about 5-7 seconds.

I've never heard a fan noise out of my machine. I don't recall ever seeing a fan at all??

I don't recall ever seeing a drain plug on the boiler. I believe you must pull the temp in order to drain the boiler.

[JohnB]

I've never heard a fan noise out of my machine. I don't recall ever seeing a fan at all??

I don't recall ever seeing a drain plug on the boiler. I believe you must pull the temp in order to drain the boiler.

On the S1 you can see the steam boiler drain when you look under the machine directly under the boiler. It sticks out so you can easily get a wrench on it. The fan sits under the black box so its pretty hard to see. s1v2/S1vsVII.html Scroll down the page for a good pic.

[chas]

Of course, IF the mini even has this same plug it would be blocked from access by the cover over the water tank. You'd essentially have to completely remove the boiler to get at it, Once you've done that you have any number of places to get the water out.