On and Off

[spaceman3]

I know this one's been covered here and there, but I'm still conflicted about keeping my mini on all day without pulling a shot. I get up in the morning, make 2-4 coffee drinks, then leave the machine on until the next morning. Sure, every once in a while I have an afternoon drink, but not really that often.

People on this forum seem to leave there machine on all day, but it gets pretty hot, and I know I'm using some electricity that could be saved. It only takes 10-15 mins for the machine to warm up, along with the portafilter and cups (along with the boiler, which I was only turning on 5 mins prior to my drink creation.) Is it worth it...

Would you guys leave it on all day if you were on my schedule? Or, turn it off after I'm done?

[Endo]

Your situation is exactly the same as mine, and I turn mine off.

I used do the 24/7 thing for the first 2 weeks after reading from others who leave it on, but I'm now convinced turning it off is better if you only make morning drinks.

What convinced me was the post about the reduced life of brewhead gaskets on machines from people running 24/7. It got me wondering about other polymer and plastic parts in the machine drying out quickly.

Maybe I'm just being parnoid, but I feel much better now simply turning on the brew boiler when I get up. I take my morning shower, then when I get back to my warmed up Mini, I turn on the steam boiler. I prepare beans and milk and get the breakfast started and in 4 minutes, the steam is ready too. After I make a Latte and perhaps a couple of espresso shots, I turn everything off.

On weekends, I may leave the brew boiler on all day since I like to have the occasional shot throughout the day. I always leave the steam boiler off though. The Mini works great if you only turn the steam boiler when needed. In my opintion this is one of the great advantages of the small Mini boiler. By keeping it off, you also reduce scale build-up. Since the Mini boiler is not serviceable (a sealed unit), I think this will make it last much longer.

Using this routine, I estimate I keep my machine on less than 300 hrs a year (steam boiler probably less than 20 hours) as opposed to over 8000 hrs if I left both on 24/7.

[BrewHaHa]

If you REALLY want reasons to obsess about this, here's a thread over on coffeed about on/off vs. on24/7:
http://www.coffeed.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=2402

One comment I thought especially interesting was from Terry at Espressoparts. Here's an excerpt: "Leaving the machine on 24/7 is the best solution for longevity. Timers on machines that turn the machine off 100% will cause a rapid build of scale. Turning the machine on and off will have the same results."

Granted, this is actually pros discussing whether to turn off the machine at night. But their reasons are interesting.

BTW, I've been leaving my Vivaldi on 24/7 for quite some time, and just today I pretty much had to chisel the group head gasket out to replace it. That was after about a year of service. (I'll try replacing it six months from now to see if it's easier - it was a bit of a chore to chisel it out!)

I'm not sure that leaving the machine on all the time is best, but it probably isn't bad. Plus, I can have a cappa any time I want. (I guess the only way to know for sure what's best is to have two machines - one on all the time, and one cycled on and off as needed. Actually, you might need to make that two of each, to rule out random chance breakdowns sullying the data.)

[oton]

I only turn on the machine when I need it. Electricity here is expensive; and I'm not sure If I want to leave a machine turned on when I'm not in home.

[JohnB]

Mine goes off in the evening & back on in the morning. If we leave for several hours during the day it goes off until we return. I use the machine throughout the day so it makes sense to leave it running but if I only used it in the morning it would go off for the rest of the day.

[Endo]

I'm open to hearing both sides of the argument. I'm always open to change if I hear a compelling argument.

Still, I've heard the "on/off" arguments before (it causes extra scale build-up, it cycles the parts more so they fatique fast, etc). I heard similar arguments for leaving computers on, lights on all day, idling your car rather then turning it off, etc . Pretty much all of these arguments I don't accept.

I like to keep it simple. For my steam boiler, who could honestly argue that 8000 hrs/year is better than my current 20 hrs/ year method?

I've seen some Vivaldis at retailers, small restaurants or gallerys that run 24/7 (and used for less than 10 shots a day). If I take off the top, it always looks like the condition of a rental cars engine when you open the hood. All kinds of baked on dust and crap, frayed plastic, peeling stickers, etc. After 6 months, mine looks as good as the day I bought it.

Here's a question that may make you decide which way to go.....if you were to buy a used Vivaldi, would you buy the one where the guy told you he left it on all the time? Or the one where the guy said he only turned it on to make shots in the morning?

[java man]

TerryZ at Espresso Parts also said that turning a Wega Lyra on in the morning with an appliance timer increases the risk of electronic controller failure. I have asked electrical engineers about this, and their answer has consistently been that this is incorrect. The circuit board on the Wega is unable to differentiate between current that is switch on by an on/off switch inside the machine and an on-off switch outside the machine. The internal on/off switch on the Wega is a simple switch with no relays or other functions built into it. After burning out the controller on my Wega, I stopped leaving it on 7/24 and went back to using an appliance timer.

I have no doubt that heat is the enemy of parts containing electrical components and many other materials. I will be running my machine on the optional La Spaziale timer, and will probably also turn the steam boiler off until I am ready to make a cappa. I do not have to worry about the increased scale build-up others may be concerned about because the water here is exceptionally soft.

Rick