Help me restore an S1

[Jake8]

First I would like to say thank you those who run this forum, its a great resource

Second I will introduce myself. My name is Jake and I love coffee. I am currently in New Orleans but am headed to Baltimore in August for dental school.

Third: I got a great deal on a Vivaldi S1 from a shop that had to close. However it needs a decent amount of TLC. I was wondering if you could help me hit all the bases to get it up and running again.

Issues

Note the machine currently isn't connected to water or power

1) Removed the steam boiler for inspection and descaling, only to find that there was about a full cup of brown clay like flakes. I rinsed out the loose pieces and then reassembled the machine and dropped in about 30-40gr citric acid into the steam boiler and filled it with water to let the steam boiler and heating element descale. Was this an extreme case of scale or worse? The inner boiler surface looked clean where the stuff flaked off so I am hoping that it is only scale and not the boiler shaving off.

2) While descaling I noticed that the drain cap at the bottom of the steam boiler is leaking no matter how much I tighten. I saw in John B.'s thread about cleaning he recommended Rectorseal 5 pipe thread sealer over teflon tape, does this sound like a reasonable solution?

3) Again with the steam boiler, how will I know when to replace the boiler gasket? I imagine this one is shot as it is had as a rock and black.

4) Should I try to mess with the group boiler? I know in John B's thread he said that he found very little scale, but enough to quickly wipe off. If you consider how much scale was in the steam boiler is it reasonable to think that the group boiler needs work too? If so is a pipe wrench about the only way to go?

5) I noticed that there was a lot of burnt milk on the steam wand. The outside cleaned up pretty easily but is there a good method to cleaning the internals?

6) I am taking it as a given that the group head gasket needs to be replaced too, but I am hoping some cafiza will clean up the screens

7) Is there anything I am leaving out? Would pictures make anything clearer?

Thanks

Jake

[JohnB]

I haven't had my steam boiler drain off in awhile but I'm thinking there might be a seal in the bottom of the drain cap. There has to be something there as it doesn't use a normal crush washer. You might get by with thread dope but since you will need to order a new group gasket, steam boiler gasket & a group boiler o'ring get a new cap if indeed the seal is molded into the cap.

The steam boiler is brass so I doubt it was the boiler flaking off. Did the acid clean off the element? I found bead blasting much more effective(a lot faster!) but if you leave it soaking in the acid for a day or two it might clean it off. I would definitely open up the brew boiler.

Remove the steam tip, unscrew the wand & soak both in a Cafizia solution along with the screens & diffuser block. Unscrew the filter on the outlet of the hot water tap & clean that out. With that much scale in the boiler you will probably want to open up the steam/hot water valve & clean it out also. Once you get the machine up & running do a serious detergent backflush session to clean out the 3 way valve & passage ways.

What is the build date of the machine? If it still has the thick diffuser block order the thin one. You can update to V2 specs, assuming you have a V1, by replacing the circuit board. There are other updates you might consider depending on the age of the machine & what has already been done.

See this page for V1 vs V2 differences: s1v2/S1vsVII.php

[chas]

I don't remember there being any kind of seal in the steam boiler drain cap. I just wrap it with teflon tape and have never had a problem with leakage.

[JohnB]

I don't remember there being any kind of seal in the steam boiler drain cap. I just wrap it with teflon tape and have never had a problem with leakage.

I've never put anything on the threads & mine has never leaked. I could be wrong about the seal but I thought I remembered seeing a rubber seal or coating in the bottom of the cap. Hard to believe it wouldn't leak if there wasn't something there & they weren't shipped with tape on the threads.

[Jake8]

Thanks for the advice

The machine part number is 252923 and is was made in 2005, it appears to have all of the latest upgrades that are standard for the V1, but correct me if I am missing something.

So far I have soaked the steam boiler in descaler overnight and things seem to be cleaning up. I think I will leave it in there for the remainder of the day to see just how much it can clean off.

What would I gain by updating to a V2 circuit board?

[JohnB]

All the S1V2 features are detailed here: http://www.chriscoffee.com/products/hom ... /vivaldi_2 As well as on the V2 site page here.

The ability to positively increase your offset, programmable pre infusion, 1*C temp selection/display, decreased delta are the biggies.

[bgour]

The ability to positively increase your offset, programmable pre infusion, 1*C temp selection/display, decreased delta are the biggies.

The V1 does have 1*C temp selection, just not display. Course setting is made at 5*C and a fine setting can be applied to offset by -3,-2,-1,0,+1,+2,+3 from the base course setting.

[Jake8]

Sounds promising

What additional changes are you looking at when you convert the circuit boards other than adding an additional manometer?

BTW took apart the group head today and was amazed at how filthy it was. There was a thick layer of espresso grinds covering the outermost screen. I actually had to pry the dispersion screens out of the machine after removing the retaining screw, and it appears the old gasket crumbled. Any suggestions on how to remove the residues and remains of the old gasket? Also should I get up into the group with a brush and clean it out, or just wait for the cafiza to come in and do some serious backflushing once it is all set up?

[JohnB]

The ability to positively increase your offset, programmable pre infusion, 1*C temp selection/display, decreased delta are the biggies.

The V1 does have 1*C temp selection, just not display. Course setting is made at 5*C and a fine setting can be applied to offset by -3,-2,-1,0,+1,+2,+3 from the base course setting.

Yes I know you can get there with the V1 but its a pita. With the new extended temp range the V2 gives you a choice of 88*C-110*C in 1* increments. Do the fine settings stay when you shut off the V1 or do you revert back to the closest 5* increment upon restart?

[JohnB]

Sounds promising

What additional changes are you looking at when you convert the circuit boards other than adding an additional manometer?

BTW took apart the group head today and was amazed at how filthy it was. There was a thick layer of espresso grinds covering the outermost screen. I actually had to pry the dispersion screens out of the machine after removing the retaining screw, and it appears the old gasket crumbled. Any suggestions on how to remove the residues and remains of the old gasket? Also should I get up into the group with a brush and clean it out, or just wait for the cafiza to come in and do some serious backflushing once it is all set up?

You will have to scrape off the gasket residue with a small chisel or flat blade screwdriver unless you want to brush something nasty like paint remover/gasket softener on the area. As far as the brown gunk I'd just wait for the Cafizia & run a couple detergent sessions back to back. Once you get the detergent up in there let it soak for a minute or two between backflushes to soften up the old gunk. Sounds like your S1 got as much regular maintenance as my old Starbucks Super Jolly.

I don't know what updates your machine has already had but I believe both the fan mounts & pump mounts were improved on later machines. If you replace the board consider replacing the steam boiler temp sensor if original. You should be able to resize the manometer hole in your front cover if you are careful. Take a look on line for dual manometer sources. There are some slightly larger round ones out there that would simplify the resizing. Alternatively you can buy everything from CC. When/if you order the newer board just ask for the 1* decal that will cover your old numbers.

[JohnB]

I don't remember there being any kind of seal in the steam boiler drain cap. I just wrap it with teflon tape and have never had a problem with leakage.

My curiosity got the better of me & it was time for a boiler draining anyway. The raised portion in the center of the cap & the area where the boiler thread seats is a soft gasket material. If this is in good shape nothing should be required to get a good seal.

[Jake8]

Hmm looking at mine, it appears that soft gasket material is gone so it looks like teflon tape for me

[bgour]

The ability to positively increase your offset, programmable pre infusion, 1*C temp selection/display, decreased delta are the biggies.

The V1 does have 1*C temp selection, just not display. Course setting is made at 5*C and a fine setting can be applied to offset by -3,-2,-1,0,+1,+2,+3 from the base course setting.

Yes I know you can get there with the V1 but its a pita. With the new extended temp range the V2 gives you a choice of 88*C-110*C in 1* increments. Do the fine settings stay when you shut off the V1 or do you revert back to the closest 5* increment upon restart?

It's really not much different on the V1: Range is 82*C-123*C in 1*C increments, and settings remain through shutdown/startup. Fine tuning is usually all that's needed so it's really not much of a pita.

[Jake8]

Well if that's the case then bgour then I will probably wait till the funds aren't so stretched to change out the circuit boards. I can wait a little while learning the machine and its intricacies before I throw preinfusion into the mix. I will probably change the temperature sensor at that point.

So I opened up the brew boiler just now and it was just as bad as I expected. To make matters worse it sprayed me with some nice putrid water that's been in there for a year or three. There was a nice layer of scale on the heating element and significant scale inside on the boiler. This offers an interesting conundrum, I want to descale the heating element and the boiler so I figure it would be best to do them together. At first I was thinking of just putting the machine on its side fill with water and citric acid close and then wait, then I realized that there would be a significant amount of gas produced by the reaction which would pressurize the chamber. I could tilt the machine and leave it in that tilted position with the cap open but I worry about putting that much weight on the face of the machine where all the electronic pieces are located.

Is my idea of pressurized acid spraying all over far fetched? Any suggestions to solve this problem?

Also it looks like the brew boiler had some sort of thread sealer on it. Would it be safe to assume I need to use some rectorseal 5 or teflon tape when reinstalling it?

Thanks for all the help

Jake

[JohnB]

There should have been a large o'ring sealing the brew boiler cap. That is all that is required. Either V1 or V2 will give you 1*C settings its what you have to go through on the V1 to get it that makes the difference. Read the V1 manual to see the selection procedure. Read up on the V2 decreased delta & programmable p/i and then decide. If none of the improvements seem worthwhile then don't bother.

[sakurama]

I restored a V1 a couple of months ago and I think anyone who gets a neglected machine thinks they got the one that can't be salvaged but they're pretty simple and all the parts are available. In my thread http://www.s1cafe.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=1091 there's some photos of what I used to descale. What I found was that letting the solution sit for a day made some progress but simmering the solution full strength dissolved the scale within an hour. That's easy to do with the steam boiler and not so easy with the brew boiler. The steam boiler in mine was much worse off so I took the extreme step of simmering it but the brew I just filled with full strength solution and left overnight and it did a pretty decent job. Patience is the tough part.

Updating to the dual pressure gauge was very simple and cheap even including the replacement panel. Most of what you will need to replace up to the board is cheap - the board isn't. Be certain to snug up the spade connections as they get loose and arc which fatigues the wires and melts the caps. If I can make one suggestion though - replace the motor mounts. That made a huge difference.

Post some photos - it can't be much worse than I dealt with and you'll be up and running in no time. I have a bunch of V1 parts from my upgrade if you need any: V1 board, old motor mounts, old gauge, old style steam arm (the back and forth three hole) and a few other misc things that work but I just wanted to replace. If something was broken they'd be better than nothing.

[Jake8]

Nice restore you did there, it gives me hope about this project. I think our steam boilers were on par, but you had it easy with the brew boiler I am charging the camera and will take some shots of the machine tonight to chronicle everything for myself and anyone else going through this process.

[JohnB]

If the group head & boiler are a mess just pull the whole assy off & do a hot citric acid soak like Sakurama described. Throw the steam boiler element in the pot also as it is probably the only way you'll get it completely clean without bead blasting. Before breaking down the grouphead/brew boiler assy. I'd check with CC & make sure they have any gaskets you might need in stock.

[Jake8]

Chriscoffee has come through again. I ended up ordering all the parts I needed and got free shipping since everything together was over $50. Ok well I threw in a steaming thermometer to put it over $50 but figured it was either that or pay just as much for shipping. Hopefully within a week this machine will be functional and pulling shots.

BTW does anyone know if an accumulator is absolutely necessary when using a flojet? Also with the flojet can I run it straight or should I put a pressure regulator valve on there?

Thanks

Jake

[Jake8]

ITS ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This past week I got the parts I needed from Chris Coffee and finished cleaning up and dialing in the machine. I am now sitting here drinking some of the best espresso I have ever had, I can even taste the citrus and berry accents of the bean

My technique needs some work but that is to be expected. It appears that I need to work on my tamping technique because the extraction came out in spurts rather than an even flow. I am still working on getting that fine spot on my hand grinder between choking the machine and pulling yellow spritzers. Right now my shots are either 8 secs or 1 minute, but they are tasting good. I will wait till tomorrow to finish dialing it in because I am already bouncing off the walls.

Thanks everyone for all the help. Now that the equipment is prepared time for the real journey of learning real espresso.

[JohnB]

ITS ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This past week I got the parts I needed from Chris Coffee and finished cleaning up and dialing in the machine. I am now sitting here drinking some of the best espresso I have ever had, I can even taste the citrus and berry accents of the bean

My technique needs some work but that is to be expected. It appears that I need to work on my tamping technique because the extraction came out in spurts rather than an even flow. I am still working on getting that fine spot on my hand grinder between choking the machine and pulling yellow spritzers. Right now my shots are either 8 secs or 1 minute, but they are tasting good. I will wait till tomorrow to finish dialing it in because I am already bouncing off the walls.

Thanks everyone for all the help. Now that the equipment is prepared time for the real journey of learning real espresso.

Glad to hear its up & running, I was wondering how the project was going. I'd bet your problems have more to do with the grind & distribution then your tamping.

[Jake8]

Probably, but the reason I think its the tamper is because I am using a 45ish mm tamper since my 53mm tamper was shipped to my parent's address which is my permanent address and the one on paypal, and I am still at school. I will have the right tamper in about a month so I'll just have to make due till then.

The grinder is a 1940's KYM from orphan so its up to the task, just a matter of dialing in the right grind. Thing is I don't know a thing about distribution other than trying to get the grinds all in there and level. Anyone care to enlighten me?

[JohnB]

Probably, but the reason I think its the tamper is because I am using a 45ish mm tamper since my 53mm tamper was shipped to my parent's address which is my permanent address and the one on paypal, and I am still at school. I will have the right tamper in about a month so I'll just have to make due till then.

The grinder is a 1940's KYM from orphan so its up to the task, just a matter of dialing in the right grind. Thing is I don't know a thing about distribution other than trying to get the grinds all in there and level. Anyone care to enlighten me?

I guess that would qualify as a "tamper problem". I use my 53mm tampers in my DC 54mm triple basket with no issues but 8mm difference is pushing it. As far as distribution goes that are several ongoing threads on H-B discussing it. From my recent experience it would seem that if your grinder turns out a high quality clump free grind all the stirring & leveling may actually cause more problems then it cures. If you have clumps you can use the WDT to break them up & if you think it matters you can use your finger or some other implement to level the dose in your basket.