Mini Vivaldi 200ml Hot Water Limiter

[Endo]

Were you one of those kids that when told "don't do that", feel the need to try it that much more. Sad to say...that's me.

I had been taking hot water from my Mini and following the 180ml (6 oz) rule in the Mini owner's manual.

Today I decide to see what would happen if I went a bit further......and something VERY interesting happened..........

The hot water tap turned off at exactly 200ml. I tried it again to be sure. Same thing. THERE IS AN AUTOMATIC HOT WATER CUT-OFF!

It all makes sense now. I wrote Chris Coffee and they told me not to go past 180ml (Chris doesn't have the limiter I'm guessing). I had also wrote LaSpaziale and when their technician wrote back he simply said "don't worry about it". So I assume the new machines direct from LaSpaziale (like mine) now have a limiter. (My 2008 machine has the vacuum valve frame cutout and new side cover frame screws).

I timed it again several times, and the limiter sequence works like this:

0 sec - hit hot water button.
5 sec - 200ml of water dispensed and hot water cut off.
10 sec- vibe pump starts to refill
25 sec - vibe pump stops and boiler heater light goes on.
80 sec - boiler heat light goes out, ready for another 200ml of hot water.

So basically this means you get 200ml of hot water in a 5 second burst (enough for a one cup tea). You can press the hot water button again any time after the water is cut-off and the water will come out again (perhaps this is what Chris is warning about), but it comes out much slower and cooler unless you wait for the boiler light to go out (after 1min 15 seconds later).

Personally, I can live with this. But if you are buying a new Vivaldi to use as a kettle (to fill a Bodum, make soup, etc), the Maxi may be a better choice.

[Endo]

Here's a video I made showing the hot water limiter kicking in after 200ml and the 20 seconds or so it takes for the vibe pump to refill the boiler.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bGklUs9Vco

[JohnB]

Kind of sounds like one of those old vibrating hockey games. Does it move around on the counter? So what did you do to pass the time before you bought the MIni? My S1V2 "automatically" cuts off the water after drawing out 32 oz but that's only because the pressure is depleted.

[Endo]

Kind of sounds like one of those old vibrating hockey games. Does it move around on the counter?

Knew someone would comment on the sound (that's why I added a note about it in the info). The little cameras really make the pump sound bad. In fact, it's the most quite machine I ever heard (not including rotaries).

Make fun of the sound all you want, at least I'm not replacing seals and bearings....ouch, low blow.

So what did you do to pass the time before you bought the MIni?

Played with my kids that you hear playing "Super Mario" in the background (past the vibe noise of course).

By the way, all playful kidding aside, how do you think the hot water is limited? Logic I assume? Any worry about exposing the heater on the bigger boiler? Don't the same worries apply? It's top mounted as well, no?

[JohnB]

Kind of sounds like one of those old vibrating hockey games. Does it move around on the counter?

Knew someone would comment on the sound (that's why I added a note about it in the info). The little cameras really make the pump sound bad. In fact, it's the most quite machine I ever heard (not including rotaries).

Make fun of the sound all you want, at least I'm not replacing seals and bearings....ouch, low blow.

So what did you do to pass the time before you bought the MIni?

Played with my kids that you hear playing "Super Mario" in the background (past the vibe noise of course).

By the way, all playful kidding aside, how do you think the hot water is limited? Logic I assume? Any worry about exposing the heater on the bigger boiler? Don't the same worries apply? It's top mounted as well, no?

[JohnB]

Make fun of the sound all you want, at least I'm not replacing seals and bearings....ouch, low blow.

By the way, all playful kidding aside, how do you think the hot water is limited? Logic I assume? Any worry about exposing the heater on the bigger boiler? Don't the same worries apply? It's top mounted as well, no?

CC sent me a brand new pump under warranty so no seals or bearings yet. It will sit in the drawer until my old pump has to be changed which could be 6-12 months from now. I'll check it again in the spring to see how bad the leak is getting.

I never heard of the issue until you brought it up so I assume it is strictly related to the slower refill time of the vibe pump & the design of your sealed in heating element. The S1 boiler holds 2.5 ltrs & the element reaches almost to the bottom. Since the most I can draw out is 32oz before the pressure fizzles the coil of the element is always under water. See my last pic in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=872

How low has your boiler pressure dropped when the hot water cut off kicks in?

[Endo]

How low has your boiler pressure dropped when the hot water cut off kicks in?

The steam boiler temp sensor turns on the heater at 1.15 bar and off at 1.40 bar. The heating cycle only takes about 4 seconds (small boiler, big heater).

The hot water cut off happens at about 1 bar (after the pump has started up and the heater has gone on). I assume it's connected to the fill sensor.

On the Mini, the boiler is only about half full. Since the steaming wattage is the same (1250W), I assume it has the same number of coils on the bottom of the heating element, only a shorter straight section. I assume the top of these coils get exposed in the Mini's very short boiler, reducing heater and sealed boiler life.

The La Spaziale tech department tells me "don't worry". So either they thhink it's a non-issue or they know the limiter will now stop me from doing damage.

I can only asssume the 6 oz warning comes from CC warranty experience (before the limiter perhaps)?