Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

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Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:26 pm

Normally once a certain point is reached the steam boiler pressure rises fairly quickly however recently it has become quite slow to reach pressure.


Once it does however there is ample steam.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by frachlitz » Mon Nov 09, 2015 12:12 am

Scale on the heating-element could be the culprit

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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 09, 2015 12:17 am

frachlitz wrote:Scale on the heating-element could be the culprit

Good thought. Would scale buildup cause a gradual slowing of pressure rise rather than an abrupt slowing?
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:40 am

Better culprit;

Opened steam boiler. Heating element sheath near top plate split exposing heating element ant white color internal packing. Virtually no scaling noted anywhere.


Also splitting seen in spiral looping. Maybe thats why it is slower to reach pressure.
Last edited by steve96822 on Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:41 am

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Source for 220V S1 heating element anyone??? Gasket is likely same as 110 volt model
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 6:25 am

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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 6:27 am

Suggestions on best way to remove nuts that hold heating element in place??
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 8:50 am

One more question if I may;

With wires from steam boiler disconnected can I use machine just for espresso ? Even if steam boiler top plate is off?
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by chas » Mon Nov 16, 2015 9:40 am

Use a metric wrench to remove the nuts on the top side of the boiler lid, then just just the heater element through. BTW: I've never seen an element blow up from an internal explosion. It must have leaked some water inside which flashed into steam and blew a hole in the side. If this had happened below the water line, it probably would have blown a fuse or tripped your home circuit breaker.

Sure you can run the machine with the steam boiler wires not attached. HOWEVER, you'll also need to press the Boiler button to electronically turn the boiler off. Otherwise, the controller knows it has commanded the Boiler to turn on and when the temp sensor fails to hit 60C within 5 minutes the machine will throw an alarm.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 9:57 am

Thanks.

When I turn on the S1 will the steam boiler water start refilling? What I need to know is if I need to secure the steam boiler top?




Actually much of the coil at water level has midline splitting and shows the white packing material. Strange indeed.

Any sources you know of for a 220V element?
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:41 am

Just tried to use S1 , powered on and immediately steam boiler began to refill. Shut off boiler but coffee boiler never got hot.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by chas » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:43 am

That's a good point. In case you forget to turn the Boiler Off you should probably put the lid back on. On the other hand, I am not sure if the refill function is also disabled when you press the Boiler button or not. Better play it safe.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:52 am

Boiler off button did stop the filling but coffee boiler never got hot
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by chas » Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:13 am

steve96822 wrote:Boiler off button did stop the filling but coffee boiler never got hot
You must have another problem then because there is no interaction that I am aware of between the two boilers other than that the steam boiler does not start heating until the group boiler is up to temp. After pressing the Boiler button the group boiler should continue functioning normally.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:27 am

Before I disconnected the steam boiler wiring all worked fine. I suspect the board needs to detect everything connected at least electrically.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 12:47 pm

Solved coffee boiler; one of the leads got disconnected to heating element. Now working
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by chas » Mon Nov 16, 2015 12:55 pm

Now that makes sense. The water level probe and the temp sensor have connections to the controller board but not the heater elements.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 1:03 pm

boiler nut 2.jpg
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The adventure continues' One of the steam boiler bolts will not thread normally. I removed all of them with dilligence and now have no idea why it wont start. All the other bolts were tried in multiple holes and work. Wher can I get a new bolt? Dont see it on the Ricambi pdf.

I may try a thred file.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by chas » Mon Nov 16, 2015 2:12 pm

I Googled A2 80 but not a lot of help. All that really means is that it's a metric stainless steel bolt made of 304 type stainless steel. I guess you need to find a local supplier of metric SS bolts, take one with you, and find a thread pitch and length match. If you have a thread chaser that can fix it that's great. If not, it's got to be cheaper to find a new bolt that to purchase a thread chaser.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by chas » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:16 pm

Here is the size to get in A2 stainless steel:

M6 x 1.0 x 12M Hex Tap Bolt

M6 means the shaft diameter is 6mm wide
1.0 means the thread pitch is one turn per millimeter
12M means the bolt length is 12mm

If you can't find A2 SS then 18-8 will do. The type of stainless steel is less important than the fact it MUST be stainless steel.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:56 am

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Thanks for bolt info.

Heres another question; The plastic cap of the thermostat came off (brittle) I can glue it back together if it will not make a difference.

See pics
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:41 am

http://www.ebay.com/itm/20PCS-M6-Series ... 76ih-t-Q8w

A2 = 304 Stainless steel

Vivaldi Steam Boiler top plate bolts

These should fit
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:10 pm

Actually there is big time failure below water line but it still worked. any stainless steel heating elements available?

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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by jfrescki » Thu Dec 10, 2015 11:48 am

That's incredible that it happened, and then continued to work.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by chas » Thu Dec 10, 2015 11:52 am

I think you're stuck with getting another copper one. On the plus side I've never heard of this happening before so odds are it won't happen to you again.
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Re: Steam Boiler slow to raise pressure

Post by steve96822 » Fri Dec 25, 2015 3:30 am

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In retrospect I think there is a scientific reason why my boiler pressure was not stopping at red-green area. I had cleaned the temperature sensor and it seemed to fix the problem but is happened again. I think I had let a lot of hot water out of steam boiler and it refilled and diluted the water-heater element chemical packing material (was leaking and coloring water) thus creating a more normotonic water in the tank.

Remember chemistry? When you add solute to water you raise the boiling point. I think the white substance was messing with the boiling point/ water properties in the boiler. My new heating element works great with the old tem sensor..

The steam boiler gasket took hours to dig out, then clean channel. That oem gasket turns into concrete and basically fuses with the boiler.
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